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EspeciallyBitter
DK wrote:

Old Peculiar is close to the real thing as is Worthington White Shield and Fullers ESB. Moorhouse Pendle witches brew is one I really like but have never tried the real thing. Don't think I have had I don't like although there are some as I have never tried the commercial beers I can't comment how close there are.

Cheers. Good to know about Old Peculiar, it's a beer I haven't had in a long while and I do miss it. The Worthington WS recipe is one that seems to get good reviews every time I see it mentioned on homebrew forums, so I must get around to having a go. It's probably dependent on using WY1028 though, I imagine?
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Clibit
GHW wrote:
Hello dk and welcome
ive not done many of wheelers recipes, it was the first book I bought as a novice and I thought most of the recipes looked damn near identical!

with a bit more experience and yeast knowledge (which he doesn’t go into in thyroid book) I can see they’re not, if still rather nuanced in their differences.

anyway long story short I’m four years and sixty plus brews in and still haven’t mastered a decent bitter! I’ve got closer with the popular colby recipe but never as good as a good commercial bitter!


Good commercial bitters are on cask though. 
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DK
Robert wrote:


I started brewing at about the same time as you, I also did a few extract brews and moved over to all grain. I did stop though, in about 2005, took it up again about six years ago, so about ten years break. Did you start with Dave Line's Big Book of Brewing as well?
The thing that I found more than anything else is how much better hop quality is now.


First book I started with was called Brewing better beers by Ken Shales very basic. Then moved on to both the David Line books.
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Robert
DK wrote:


First book I started with was called Brewing better beers by Ken Shales very basic. Then moved on to both the David Line books.


I had that Ken Shales book too.
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DK
Robert wrote:


I had that Ken Shales book too.


He lived around the corner to me but died a couple of years before I started brewing. I have talked to few people that knew/drank with him, he used to brew a breakfast beer so no wonder he died fairly young.
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Robert
DK wrote:


He lived around the corner to me but died a couple of years before I started brewing. I have talked to few people that knew/drank with him, he used to brew a breakfast beer so no wonder he died fairly young.


Dave Line went fairly young too. I've wondered if it was using non-foodsafe stuff, such as plastic dustbins, that did for them. Breakfast beer would help, mind.
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Hops_and_Dreams
Welcome to the forum DK.
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Tigermoth
Robert wrote:


Dave Line went fairly young too. I've wondered if it was using non-foodsafe stuff, such as plastic dustbins, that did for them. Breakfast beer would help, mind.


Gosh don't say that I used a yellow plastic dustbin for my early brews too ðŸ˜„. Do you recognise these oldies?
IMG_2652.jpg 
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DK


Gosh don't say that I used a yellow plastic dustbin for my early brews too Ã°Å¸Ëœâ€ž. Do you recognise these oldies?
IMG_2652.jpg [/QUOT


Got the Ken Shales and David line ones.]
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Tigermoth
DK wrote:


Gosh don't say that I used a yellow plastic dustbin for my early brews too ÃƒÂ°Ã…¸Ëœâ€ž. Do you recognise these oldies?
IMG_2652.jpg [/QUOT
The Turner and Moon first got me interested that there maybe something beyond malt extract brewing. The Dave Line book and Dave Miller book got me right into it then Brewing beers like those you buy by Dave Line became a favourite for quite a while.


Got the Ken Shales and David line ones.]
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Robert
Standing on the shoulders of giants. I had the Big Book of Brewing and Advanced Home Brewing but lost them years ago. Was AHB the one with recipes using diastastic malt extract mashes with crystal malts and adjuncts (flaked maize, torrified wheat, flaked barley etc) in them? I did that a few times after brewing kits, before I decided I didn't like the results of those much either and moved onto "all grain" with the help of Dave Line's book.
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Tigermoth
Robert wrote:
Standing on the shoulders of giants. I had the Big Book of Brewing and Advanced Home Brewing but lost them years ago. Was AHB the one with recipes using diastastic malt extract mashes with crystal malts and adjuncts (flaked maize, torrified wheat, flaked barley etc) in them? I did that a few times after brewing kits, before I decided I didn't like the results of those much either and moved onto "all grain" with the help of Dave Line's book.


Yes Robert you are correct and it was the same with me Dave Line's book and also Dave Millers book also was the turning point for me to all grain beer and now have other more modern day books but the basics for all grain brewing is still much the same as in Dave Line's day wouldn't you agree. Hops, Yeast, Water and Malt have many varieties these days that may not have been so available to the home brewer in Line's days. The world is our oyster with home brewing now isn't it. 
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Robert

Tigermoth wrote:


Yes Robert you are correct and it was the same with me Dave Line's book and also Dave Millers book also was the turning point for me to all grain beer and now have other more modern day books but the basics for all grain brewing is still much the same as in Dave Line's day wouldn't you agree. Hops, Yeast, Water and Malt have many varieties these days that may not have been so available to the home brewer in Line's days. The world is our oyster with home brewing now isn't it. 


I'm sure much of the content would be laughed at now but Dave Lines book was ideal for the time. I remember it had a really good, simple way for amateurs to work out how much grain to use when designing recipes, also a good way of propagating yeast from Guinness bottles, much needed given the yeast available then. The thing that I noticed more than anything else when I took up brewing again a few years ago was the massive difference in the quality of hops, never mind the variety. Hops from the local wine making (invariably) shop used to come in perforated bags and they were all dried up. I really didn't realise what hops were supposed to be like. I was most surprised at how few you needed to use to make a bitter, 30g? I used to use about 3.5oz in five gallons.

 

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EspeciallyBitter
I have Dave Line's Big Book of Brewing. His approach to calculating degrees of extract seems pretty intuitive and I'm struck by how much it reminds me of the way it's explained in Palmer's How to Brew. I can easily imagine how DL's books were a godsend for home brewers dipping their toe into all-grain in the 70s and 80s when the whole thing must have seemed terribly arcane and you couldn't just google it. He was ahead of his time, it's a shame he didn't live to see how home brewing has come on.
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DK
David Lines recipe book totally changed by brewing and also my mates started visiting more as the beer was so much better. I continued to use that book, as well as my own recipes, until Graham Wheelers books came out.
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